Einstein forgot to carry the one...

SlimSkeeter

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The First Test That ProvesGeneral Relativity is wrong.

A spinning top increases its weight much more than expected


By Vlad Tarko, Senior Editor, Sci-Tech News

March 24th, 2006, 12:39 GMT


According to Einstein's theory of general relativity, a moving mass should create another field, called gravitomagnetic field, besides its static gravitational field. This field has now been measured for the first time and to the scientists' astonishment, it proved to be no less than one hundred million trillion times larger than Einstein's General Relativity predicts.

This gravitomagnetic field is similar to the magnetic field produced by a moving electric charge (hence the name "gravitomagnetic" analogous to "electromagnetic"). For example, the electric charges moving in a coil produce a magnetic field - such a coil behaves like a magnet. Similarly, the gravitomagnetic field can be produced to be a mass moving in a circle. What the electric charge is for electromagnetism, mass is for gravitation theory (the general theory of relativity).

A spinning top weights more than the same top standing
still. However, according to Einstein's theory, the difference is negligible. It should be so small that we shouldn't even be capable of measuring it. But now scientists from the European Space Agancy, Martin Tajmar, Clovis de Matos and their colleagues, have actually measured it. At first they couldn't believe the result.

"We ran more than 250 experiments, improved the facility over 3 years and discussed the validity of the results for 8 months before making this announcement. Now we are confident about the measurement," says Tajmar. They hope other physicists will now conduct their own versions of the experiment so they could be absolutely certain that they have really measured the gravitomagnetic field and not something else. This may be the first empiric clue for how to merge together quantum mechanics and general theory of relativity in a single unified theory.

"If confirmed, this would be a major breakthrough," says Tajmar, "it opens up a new means of investigating general relativity and its consequences in the quantum world."

The experiment involved a ring of superconducting material rotating up to 6 500 times a minute. According to quantum theory, spinning superconductors should produce a weak magnetic field. The problem was that Tajmar and de Matos experiments with spinning superconductors didn't seem to fit the theory - although in all other aspects the quantum theory gives incredibly accurate predictions. Tajmar and de Matos then had the idea that maybe the quantum theory wasn't wrong after all but that there was some additional effect overlapping over their experiments, some effect they neglected.

What could this other effect be? They thought maybe it's the gravitomagnetic field - the fact that the spinning top exerts a higher gravitational force. So, they placed around the spinning superconductor a series of very sensible acceleration sensors for measuring whether this effect really existed. They obtained more than they bargained for!

Although the acceleration produced by the spinning superconductor was 100 millionths of the acceleration due to the Earth's gravitational field, it is a surprising one hundred million trillion times larger than Einstein's General Relativity predicts. Thus, the spinning top generated a much more powerful gravitomagnetic field than expected.

Now, it remains the need for a proper theory. Scientists can also now check whether candidate theories, such as the string theory, can describe this experiment correctly. Moreover, this experiment shows that gravitational waves should be much more easily to detect than previously thought.



I know its years old but I hadn't heard of this before. I'm more excited by this than I should be.... its one more step towards a grand Theory of Everything that bridges the gap between quantum and relatiavistic physics. Somewhere as you go down in scale, things start to act funky and the universal laws we are used to seem to fail dramatically... even seeming to violate the speed of light barrier.

Bridging that gap would bring us one step closer to understanding the fundamentals of the universe.
 

Klautermauffen

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I don't think I've seen this before. Interesting read!! :) I wish I knew more so I could say more than "interesting" (lame), but I don't.
 

4nik8

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I just hope the experiment stands up (can be duplicated)

Quantum physics and Einsteins theory of general relativity have been at odds. (When trying to mesh them... well not so much at odds as it is giving answers that are either infinite in sum or probabilities greater that 100%)

Just think of the breakthroughs that could happen if these two lines of thought can be merged!
 

SlimSkeeter

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I had thought Einsteins Relativity and Newtons Mechanics have been pushed to the side lines, years ago, by Quantum Mechanics.

Did I miss something here?
Einsteins Theories as well as Newtons work well when it comes to macroscopic things (though as we learn more, both are getting less and less reliable)...the world you can see works within (mostly) the parameters that they set forth. The funky stuff starts happening when you start observing the atomic and subatomic level. I'm not sure if anyone actually knows at what point the rules flip the switch but somewhere things disagree and that's rather irksome to scientists. Hopefully this starts connecting the dots.
 

KommieKat

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Einsteins Theories as well as Newtons work well when it comes to macroscopic things (though as we learn more, both are getting less and less reliable)...the world you can see works within (mostly) the parameters that they set forth. The funky stuff starts happening when you start observing the atomic and subatomic level. I'm not sure if anyone actually knows at what point the rules flip the switch but somewhere things disagree and that's rather irksome to scientists. Hopefully this starts connecting the dots.
I believe it's when two atoms collide with the work they've done at CERN?
 

4nik8

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I believe it's when two atoms collide with the work they've done at CERN?
On the sub atomic level, they've found that electrons can be in more than one place at the same time.
This has given rise to thoughts on time travel. Or parallel universes... or multiverses...
shit like that is what makes me enjoy getting high while studying.
:wink:
 

SlimSkeeter

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CERN in Switzerland?

Particle accelerators?

CERN
http://public.web.cern.ch/public/
I know what CERN is, I was excited for them to start up that massive supercollider, but they had issues...etc.

The wording of that sentence was clumsy and confusing to me.

Are you saying that the point in which quantum physics takes over is when atoms collide? Or are you referring to the research into quantum physics they are doing at CERN with their supercollider, where they are smashing atoms into their individual components to see what shows up?

Please explain...
 

KommieKat

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I know what CERN is, I was excited for them to start up but they had issues...etc.

The wording of that sentence was clumsy and confusing to me.

Are you saying that the point in which quantum physics takes over is when atoms collide? Or are you referring to the research into quantum physics they are doing at CERN with their supercollider, where they are smashing atoms into their individual components to see what shows up?

Please explain...

What surprises me, is that my sentence was kept as such a minimalist of words, you still did not catch on.

CERN has been around along time. At least 5 decades by now and what armchair theorist have been spouting on about in regards to Quantum mechanics have been proved or shown at the CERN facility.

I one says, "Bread?" , "Peanutbutter?".....
Is that not enough to convey a peanutbutter sandwich?

Communication through vocalizing words is only going to get shorter in the near future........try looking for the obvious next time..........FOOLS!!
 

SlimSkeeter

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What surprises me, is that my sentence was kept as such a minimalist of words, you still did not catch on.

CERN has been around along time. At least 5 decades by now and what armchair theorist have been spouting on about in regards to Quantum mechanics have been proved or shown at the CERN facility.

I one says, "Bread?" , "Peanutbutter?".....
Is that not enough to convey a peanutbutter sandwich?

Communication through vocalizing words is only going to get shorter in the near future........try looking for the obvious next time..........FOOLS!!
alrighty...

Tesla solder with armpits. gotcha.

Basically, I don't know what you were trying to convey, but what you said was that two atoms hit some work being done at CERN.
 

KommieKat

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alrighty...

Tesla solder with armpits. gotcha.

Basically, I don't know what you were trying to convey, but what you said was that two atoms hit some work being done at CERN.
Ah! You mentioned Tesla! Now THERE's a hero is ever there was one.

Why in hell one of the Hollywood gods have not done a movie based on his life, really amazes me, and I don't mean some small part in a movie, played by David Bowie, although he's my hero as well.