How would you fix the US economy?

funeeman

Spank Me!
Founder
Mar 3, 2008
586
1
16
45
North Main Street
Looks like the senate and the house finally agreed on a stimulus bill. I've heard all the talking heads that love it talk about the fact that they love it and I've heard the other half talk about the fact that they hate it. I know its designed to create jobs through infrastructure and energy (similar to the New Deal except stemming from the private sector) as well as give a tax cut to the middle class and lower class, plus it has a rebate portion. According to most analysts (including Bush's financial advisers) you need to have a combo of all three to be successful in what they are trying to do. I'm just wondering what the effects will be and how quickly.

One expert said the fastest way to fix the economy was to give 800 billion to the citizens of the US. Each tax payer would get $20,000, give grants to make homes energy efficient through windows and siding, and have a 1 year hold on housing (mortgage) payments interest being paid to the banks from the 800 billion. This would allow the majority of people to get out of debt, create a safety savings and still allow them to make purchases stimulating the economy. Plus it would create jobs because of the energy improvements.

Me personally. . that plan would really benefit me but its a pipe dream.

But if you had the power to try and stimulate the economy and make a turn around. . .how would you try to do it?
 

rammstein1861

Masticater
Founder
Jan 8, 2009
96
0
6
32
Alt F4 if you wanna know.
I really like the pipe dream Idea.

If it were up to me, I would come right out of the gate and delete NAFTA.
Next, tariff more on foreign goods.
Halt foreclosures from banks that made horrible lending decisions.
Wait for said banks to fail.
Nationalize banks.
Give some form of government incentive to those companies attempting to keep it's product in America, and stop helping these corporate assclowns from buying up and selling off American companies.

O and on a side note, to keep oil prices lower....sell the Arabs corn at the same price they charge for their oil. barrel for bushel.
 

Lethal_Lefty

[P]resident
Jan 12, 2009
93
0
6
36
We should just go back to the barter system.

"I see you have a shiny, circular pendent. I will trade you this half eaten cheeseburger and a slightly used tampon for it."
 

Negativecool

Gold Member
Founder
May 30, 2008
2,359
43
78
39
Internet
Politicians aren't accountants or economists. They have no idea how to fix the economy, they're just taking advice from people that actually know what the fuck is going on.
These people tell the politicians what to do and this message, in turn, is naturally diluted by this "politician middle man" and thus the real solution is lost.

Take it out of the politician's hands and into the hands of the people that know.

This advice brought to you by: Crazy Neg
 

Kill_em_All

Family
Founder
Jul 29, 2008
324
0
16
43
Surprised this hasn't seen more posts.

Fuck the stimulus plan. That thing has more holes than the fucking Iraqi army.

The fed could start by hiking up the interest rate so that every asshole with a tax refund which could be used as a down payment isn't considered a prime home loan candidate.

Of course, that would have been a nice solution ten years ago when the mortgage industry was booming and banks were handing out cash faster than the fuckin government could print it, but better late than never, right?

Forget about dumping taxpayer dollars into these banks which are only failing because of one thing; Their own ineptitude.

If my business fails, I don't get any second chances. I can't go to congress and beg them for a "loan" to keep my struggling company afloat. But for some reason these financial institutions can do just that, even though the only reason they're so destitude is because they were too stupid to realize that JUST MAYBE throwing loans to anyone with a fucking pulse and the ability to sign on the dotted line wasn't a great idea.

Fuck 'em. Let 'em go bankrupt. Stop throwing money at these assholes.

Next: Car companies. Fuck them, too. The Big 3 have lived in this fairtale world that American families would continue buying two and three cars per decade for too long, and it's because of their poor planning (not to mention the shitty value of American made automobiles as compared to their initial cost) that has forced them into this position.

Don't give these corporate dicks a goddamned cent. Let 'em go under. And as for the people that work for the car companies who get laid off, I've got four words for you; learn to fucking type. That, or get a job in the automotive repair sector, which is not only staying afloat, but thriving in the current economic environment.

Next up: Social services. Cut any and all social services to families who have been in this country for less than two years, illegally or otherwise. Obviously this would take some fine tuning, and I suggest having social workers look at each case individually, but overall, the majority are included. If you haven't been here for at least 2 years, you can either find a better paying job and roll with the punches, or you can go back to wherever the fuck you came from.

Moving on: Redistribution of wealth. All of this money that Obama wants to pump into this stimulus plan would be far better served going right back into the pockets of the American taxpayer. It's a pretty simple concept, actually. Give the 900 million dollars in federal tax dollars that the current dumbfuck administration plans on handing out to failing lending institutions back to the people who have earned it and TRULY DESERVE it. It's OUR FUCKING MONEY, and we are the ones who are struggling. We're struggling to pay our electric bills which continue to see rate hikes. We're struggling to make rent, maintain employment, and keep clothes on our kids' backs. You think some bank CEO with his feet kicked up on his cherrywood desk is worrying about this shit?

You want to stimulate the economy, you start with the consumer, not the fucking lending institutions and car companies, you goddamned federal dildos. Give money back to the people, they invest it, thus keeping the financial institutions running. They buy new cars, keeping the automotive industry running.

Giving the banks and car companies money is totally putting the chicken before the fuckin egg and someone needs to slap the shit out of Saddam Hussein Osama before he buttfucks us into a worse situation than we're already in.

Oh, and another idea I have, which is completely ridiculous (yet plausible) is this: Print more money. Print more money, and invest it in Mexico. That's right, Mexico. How none of these American banks haven't thought of this yet is beyond me.

The exchange rate on the American dollar is about one to ten. So every American dollar is worth ten dollars in Mexico. That's why so many Mexicans come to America in the first place. They can get a job making 4 bucks an hour here, Western Union the money back home to Papa Pedro where he, in turn, multiplies it by ten. I say, put in a branch of the federal reserve right in the middle of Mexico City, and transfer funds there all fucking day long.

Mexicans have been taking advantage of this loophole for years, and I think it's our turn.
 

KommieKat

Mao's Pet Cat
Founder
Mar 2, 2008
3,497
6
68
58
Hong Kong, hiding from the Kommies!
If it were up to me, I would come right out of the gate and delete NAFTA.
This one is good. While we are at it, get rid of the IMF and World Bank.
They have done nothing but make themselves rich from when they started back in the late '40s. If you work for one of them, your life is good. They only care about themselves.

Next, tariff more on foreign goods.
This one Not good. It only leads to political gaming. If we do that, they will do it in return. Case in point: I have to pay 3 times more for my Visa to enter China whereas most other nationalities pay little or nothing. We fuck with China and they fuck with us in return. It's only the little guy like me that suffers.

Also, lots of U.S. companies are located overseas with manufacturing and production factories. You want to pay a higher price for that pair of Nike shoes than what you already pay?

Surprised this hasn't seen more posts.
This was a very good post by Kill.

This situation is quite similar to Japan back in 1990 when the Bubble Economy burst open. I landed in Japan in '89 and could not believe how people were spending money and practically throwing it away like crazy.

The Bubble burst due to shitty real estate speculation and bad bank loans. 40% of those loans went to the Japanese mafia who got them through intimidation and that forty percent will never be paid back.

The Japanese government poured money into the banks as well as zombie companies and even 19 years later their economy is still screwed.

Have any idea what this means??!! It means that we are in for a long long bumpy ride for the next 20 years. By the end of 2009, there will be in the U.S., 9% unemployment or more.

My recommendation is to solve the problems first:

#1 Replace the banking regulators. They did shit nothing. They did not regulating which means they did not do their job! Replace them and get people in there who will do as they are suppose to do.

#2 Replace the SEC regulators. They also did not do their job.
Stock broker greed lead to this crisis as well as lax attitudes by the SEC.

#3 Put a cap on CEO salaries. The executives at The Body Shop did just that.
A person can live a great life on a million or two, but do you really need a few billion? WTF for? Again, avarice lead to this crises.

I perfectly understand that you have a right to make as much as you can but really, do you need U.S.$5 billion dollars? Be realistic about this.

#4 The U.S. government should not have listened to Alan Greenspan.
Mr. Greenspan did not let the market run it's course. In a capitalistic market, you are going to have winners and losers. You cannot do your march for capitalism and wave your flag if you cannot accept that there are losers as well. Mr. Greenspan, helping his buddies by bailing them out did nothing to help the economy as a whole.........so what Kill said here.........
Don't give these corporate dicks a goddamned cent. Let 'em go under.........................Fuck 'em. Let 'em go bankrupt. Stop throwing money at these assholes.
is in line with a capitalistic market.

This goes for all industries including banking, brokerage houses and automotive. Fuck them. They fucked up so why do make tax payers foot the bill? Makes no sense in a capitalistic economy.

So, let the market run it's course.

#5 Get those U.S. companies who have gone overseas to transplant back within the continental United States. Give those companies who transplant back here fantastic dream worthy tax breaks or better yet, don't tax them at all, on the condition that they hire U.S. citizens and pay them fair wages that match their qualifications and skills. Companies love tax incentives.

#6 Open the doors to foreign investors. If Toyota, Sharp, Samsung, Ericsson or Phillips want to open factories in the U.S, then goddamn let them do it if it gets people back into the work force.

#7 DO NOT bail out anybody. Instead put the money back into the pockets of the people as stated here.....
Give the 900 million dollars in federal tax dollars that the current dumbfuck administration plans on handing out to failing lending institutions back to the people who have earned it and TRULY DESERVE it. It's OUR FUCKING MONEY,......
so as to stimulate the economy through the purchasing power of the U.S. consumer who was, supposedly the biggest in the world.

#8 Cut up your credit cards. Why do you need Visa, MasterCard, American Express, Sears, Woolworth, Exxon and Mobile? Did I miss one or three or five?

Keep one card for emergency or for traveling during vacation time.
Pay your bill within that month or soon, very very soon after wards. The banks are counting on you to not only pay later, but to be late on your payments.

If you are paying up to 48% interest, you are being extorted by the bank.
Just two days ago, CitiBank was doing just this. By law, anything that is 48% or more is classified as extortion.

Lastly, pay by cash. If you don't have the cash for it, than most likely, you don't need it and can live without it.
 

funeeman

Spank Me!
Founder
Mar 3, 2008
586
1
16
45
North Main Street
I agree with Kill and Buddha that we can't just bail out the banks, auto industry, etc all the time. . and had one occurred without the other I'm more inclined to agree. My question is if we do that and let both fail the "down the line" effect on us would be huge. I'm just guessing but I'd say those two industries probably effect 60% of the us work force and the banks I guess at least on the very surface effect every business.

I think buddha kind of hit it on the head. . . .if we let these guys fail we need to have an industry or job there and available in the market for the influx of workers. We'll need to let the foreign industry into our nation. But would this really happen?

Unfortunately our labor factor is outrageous in this country. It just not very cost effective. I know that my labor is roughly 40%. That's fucking ridiculous. As a business owner every dollar I make almost 1/2 goes to my employee. Then the remaining 60% is nickeled and dimed by overhead costs such as my buildings, equipment, energy, etc. If I see 20% that friggin fantastic. Then I'm double taxed as a business and then again on personal income at the end of the year. In the end I don't make a ton of money. I'd be better off trying to find a job that would pay me what my salary is on paper and having very little risk associated with it financially. My biggest fear would be that I couldn't control my pay increase, make the decisions I make to move my company forward and the always big fear of what happens if there is a change in ownership, etc for my job in the future.

What I've actually had to do is begin to purchase more and more of my inventory from overseas. I have to wait twice as long to get it at a very minimum usually its a 3 -4 month delivery vs 6-8 weeks domestic, but the cost of it is usually the difference in a 10-20% price difference to my customer and about a 10% increase for me in my mark up. Plus my volume goes up because of the discounts I'm able to offer. Well. . .for me to survive as a business I pay foreign cheap labor which now hurts the us workforce.


So if we do let those two industries go under then we really need to do a couple of things to create jobs competitively with the global economy, which means we have to have cheaper labor. I think this could be done in a couple of way. 1- eliminate unions. They've outlived their usefulness. They've actually over inflated many salaries just so they could fund themselves. My brothers in a union as a welder and a significant portion of his wages go to the unions. I don't remember the exact figure but if hes making $35 per hour like $10 an hour goes to his union. Now there's even a bigger issue as the unions want votes to be non-private when deciding things. . .its basiclly using intimidation to sway votes. And what they're really voting on beside salaries I've got no idea. The started to help regulate safety and work week hours. That's all in law now. . they're not needed.

2 - We've got to lower insurance. I'm not just talking about the health insurance which is fucking outrageous, but also things like workers compensation. I pay around $100,000 a year for a handful of employees. This is because we've got sue happy folks around here trying to get a fast buck for every little accident. We had a guy . . .who was stupid, washing off stones. He tripped on the garden hose he was using and tore his knee. The insurance paid to fix his knee and then gave him an additional $4000 for the permanent damage that was done. His knee won't be as strong as it was before which wasn't that strong because it tore from tripping on a hose. Now. . .keep in mind as a business owner I wasn't at fault because of his clumsiness or the fact that he didn't hang the hose on the hose rack right next to him between washing the two stones. But that accident was enough to raise my premium over 10 grand a year. At the very least since it was preventable by the employee we should have only been required to fix his knee not the extra cash for "future" non-use of a standard knee. Furthermore he's got health insurance which I pay for that should have covered the knee surgery. Had he done this at home it would have been from his pocket and that insurance.

I don't know what the answer is 100% but perhaps if an accident happens a third party investigates and if the employee is at fault its his tough shit. I have monthly safety meetings, we've taken tens of thousands of dollars to invest in safety each year and yet you can't out safety stupidity. When my grandfather crushed in hand back in the day and lost the use of his left one (pretty costly for a welder) he got a $50 check for the injury and was told "see ya if you can't figure out how to weld anymore." While that's not right now days the guy get a big settlement, $$ for retraining, and a permanent monthly disability check.
Maybe the solution is if you spring for health for your employees health insurance you're allowed to take that sum of that premium off of the workers comp premium and use that insurance in the event of an accident. This would probably have a double good effect because it would save the business owner money from essentially having to double cover his employees and the chances are more employees would receive health benefits from their employers which takes less of a burden off of the tax payer the non insured. I know if I can pay $3000+ a year per employee for workers comp or pay $2400 for health insurance and then $600 toward the workers comp for that employee I'd give them the benefit to them and have them covered 100% of the time off and on the job. In the end, you'll have about a 30-40% savings for most companies just on insuring those folks. Plus chances are my personal taxes will be lowered because I'm not forking out billions for the McDonald's worker who can't afford to pay his doctors bills so he uses the ER 15 times a year and sticks me with an unpaid bill.

So. . the quick of it to make forigen investmetn in the US labor force

1-eliminate unions and their cut of the worker's salary to lower overall costs of the average wage

2 - reduce insurance cost to make it affordable to manufacture goods here and still make a profit.
 

KommieKat

Mao's Pet Cat
Founder
Mar 2, 2008
3,497
6
68
58
Hong Kong, hiding from the Kommies!
Not meant to scare you, but check these vids out.......

Jim Rogers
[video=youtube;w84EiCt0Lqk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w84EiCt0Lqk&NR=1[/video]

Peter Schiff.........crappy audio
[video=youtube;9h2x7R8pxUs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h2x7R8pxUs&feature=related[/video]
 

Kill_em_All

Family
Founder
Jul 29, 2008
324
0
16
43
I just wanted to add one more thing here...

I don't have a problem with capitalism. I think that under the right conditions, it's an ethos that has the potential to reward hard work.

That being said, I think we need to tighten regulations on U.S. based corporations' outsourcing jobs to foreign nations...at least temporarily.

I think it's bullshit that we're living in a struggling economy and there are businesses which are based here, distribute products and services exclusively to U.S. consumers while raping us with ridiculous rates which further perpetuates the downward spiral of our weakening economy, and have the audacity to outsource hundreds of thousands of jobs to foreign nations.

If you're based here, market consumerism exclusively to our residents, you goddamned well should have to hire here.
 

funeeman

Spank Me!
Founder
Mar 3, 2008
586
1
16
45
North Main Street
I just wanted to add one more thing here...

I don't have a problem with capitalism. I think that under the right conditions, it's an ethos that has the potential to reward hard work.

That being said, I think we need to tighten regulations on U.S. based corporations' outsourcing jobs to foreign nations...at least temporarily.

I think it's bullshit that we're living in a struggling economy and there are businesses which are based here, distribute products and services exclusively to U.S. consumers while raping us with ridiculous rates which further perpetuates the downward spiral of our weakening economy, and have the audacity to outsource hundreds of thousands of jobs to foreign nations.

If you're based here, market consumerism exclusively to our residents, you goddamned well should have to hire here.
It will never happen just of simple fact that even if you're in a localized area you're still dealing with global competition. The Internet has unfortunately added to this. You not only now have to be competitive with your product against your competitors you have to be in line with what the rest of the country or world is doing too. In order to keep those prices in line you have to keep your costs down. You either have to find cheaper materials or cheaper labor. The latter is the easier to find because pretty much the cost of steel is the cost of steel world wide. . .but Chuck cost me $14 dollars an hour in the us plus benefits, Paco costs me $4 a day in Mexico, or Kim Chum Chee cost me $3 a week in China.
 

funeeman

Spank Me!
Founder
Mar 3, 2008
586
1
16
45
North Main Street
Kim Chum Chee is a Korean name and you sure as hell aren't getting him for less than US$15.

If he is Chinese, you'll be paying about US$500 a month and wages are rising.
I wish I could get my labor for $16 bucks a day.


I've actually heard of the quarries in China giving food and shelter in exchange for work. No money. . don't know if its true but its a prevalent myth among US quarries. I of course buy direct from US quarries who often now have a "foreign" quarry representative and they exchange blocks for resale in each others country. My quarry does by some manufactured goods from China as well, but I know they're doing it from the higher end folks who have a few more standards and thus a little more in costs.
 

KommieKat

Mao's Pet Cat
Founder
Mar 2, 2008
3,497
6
68
58
Hong Kong, hiding from the Kommies!
I wish I could get my labor for $16 bucks a day.


I've actually heard of the quarries in China giving food and shelter in exchange for work. No money. . don't know if its true but its a prevalent myth among US quarries. I of course buy direct from US quarries who often now have a "foreign" quarry representative and they exchange blocks for resale in each others country. My quarry does by some manufactured goods from China as well, but I know they're doing it from the higher end folks who have a few more standards and thus a little more in costs.
Not sure if quarries do this, but there are some factories that do.
When you hear of a factory worker being paid about US$100 or so a month, it's because they are being provided with shelter and food, therefore the low pay.
 

Kill_em_All

Family
Founder
Jul 29, 2008
324
0
16
43
This is why I oversell my company's services, don't hire anyone, hoard the profits for myself, and rarely deliver on my promises to my clients.